Need help - mp9 wiring

scroodrv
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Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by scroodrv »

Hey Guys, we bought this 1.8 motor complete with mp9 loom and ecu. Dropped the motor in on saturday, all went ok. Got onto the wiring loom and encounted a few problems. The red crosses indicate what is not obviously visible on the loom

Image

Have fitted all the wires with the nice VW connectors on, they are easy..

These are the wires I have left:
Image
1. The red one is a small gauge wire, could reach starter motor but looks very skinny? not sure where this one will go.
Image
yellow wire with red stripe? Not sure, we dont have an air temp wire, so could be that?
Image
The black and yellow Im thinking is the power, power only when ignition is on. Green wire I think goes to pin no. 6 on the TCI unit?
Image
This pic is of the ecu connector, just for info to help someone whos know the loom identify the rouge wires

The only ground on the had a circular crimp so we connected it to the cylinder head, hope thats ok?
TIA

just notice something different on the top pic - where i put the red cross over the temp sensor wire, the loom we have, has the vw connector on it, not a single wire...
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UDC
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by UDC »

that yellow/red should be going to the water temp gauge, is it running of the 4 pin water temp plug?
the green looks like the rev counter signal.
the red could be for your oil pressure, you need to back trace it, normally its a blue wire
nothing from the mp9 harness goes to the starter.
scroodrv
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by scroodrv »

will test the yellow/red with the multimeter but i think you right, its the temp signal for the dash
The green may well go to the rev counter, but then what connects to the TCI unit?
will trace back the red and see which pin it goes to on the ecu
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panic-mechanic
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by panic-mechanic »

Unless they use the red as a power wire for a relay and then the big starter will always supply 12v. Exactly the same as battery +
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scroodrv
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by scroodrv »

there is no red big wire going to the starter, just the small gauge red wire. Could it be the low current side of the fuel pump relay? Then I must install the high current side and relay. If I power up the ecu and test it with a multimeter and it shows 12V+ can I assume its the fuel pump relay?

FYI: this loom was originally doctored for a CTI converted to MP9. This project im trying to change from 1.3 carb citi golf to 1.8i
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by Nadasen »

Hey guys. Converted my golf from mpi to mp9 the problem I'm having is the idle with map sensor and tps connected car missing and idles like it has a big cam. But if u remove either one plug car is fine. Any tips to sort it out.
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by UDC »

most likely the map sensor is stuffed, run a diagnostics on the car and see what errors come up
Ashveer03
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by Ashveer03 »

+1 on the map sensor.

I seen a faulty map sensor on mp9s with no fault codes

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Gert van Staden
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by Gert van Staden »

Hi. Is the i jectors not smaller on the mpi compared to the mp9 ones?

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Brandy01
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by Brandy01 »

Need assistance please,1996 Golf Mk3 Gti 2.0L 8v AFW. Forgive my ignorance,but i am still learning VW and fuel injection because i come from Toyota carb.
I know mp9 is a management system But which parts/components are classified as mp9?
I know i have an mp9 intake,I have a Bosch Polocup 7800rpm ecu.
Another issue im having is that the ecu will not allow throttle adaption. I fixed broken wires in the loom to throttle body as well.
I went further along the loom and noticed that the brown/white wire coming from pin 7 on throttle body,is spliced to 4 wires.
Have not had the time yet to carry on and trace those 4 wires to the ecu connector to check which pins.
Is this correct though? It looks like a factory join but i could be wrong
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by UDC »

throttle adaption will not take place if any faults logged on VCDS, you have to clear all faults before doing the TB calibration.

pin 7 is a common ground for the sensors i.e Map Sensor (Pin/No.1) + Dizzy (Pin/No.1) + Throttle Body (Pin/No.7) + 4 Pin Water Temp (Pin/No.1) and goes to Pin 17 of the ECU
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by Brandy01 »

Yes the faults were cleared (unless he was talking k#k)
Oh ok thank you, because i was going off previous posts for mp9 but maybe i got my facts crossed with otber info.
As i understand it and am working from is the throttle body pins,when looking at the connector on the tb itself it should be from left to right pin 1 3 5 7 on top and pin 2 4 6 8 (6 being blank)
Pin 1 brown/yellow
2 red/black
3 purple/white
4 blue/grey
5 red/white
6 n/a
7 brown/white
8 blue/black
My info as to what each wire is,is definitely wrong according to what you are saying UDC.
I have been battling with this car for just over a year now because i lost my job in April so it's a bit difficult getting my car to the right people.
I have replaced the tb as well.
The 2 error codes which came back after being cleared are below,(about May last year) this was before i fixed the 2 damaged wires.(only about August ) I will need to check which 2 wires were damaged. It was now in January when the codes were able to clear the guy told me. But yet he could not do adaption.
00533 Idle speed control
65535 Control module faulty
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by UDC »

TB pin outs

Throttle Body
T/B Pin no. to Ecu Pin No.
1 - 2
2 - 26
3 - 10
4 - 14
5 - 41
6 N/A
7 - 17
8 - 16

The Idle speed control is a bit of a tricky error and does not clear easily, could be linked to a issue with the ECU when it was remapped, as soon as you clear it the error will re-appear and prevent the TB Calibration.

What is the actual problem with the car and why do you need to calibrate the TB
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by Brandy01 »

Cool thnx. The tb where the cable attatches "shakes" when the car is idling,I had an erratic idle which i eventually figured out to be the dizzy trigger wheel which was bent out of shape. (I asked my original mechanic the same week i got the car,if that bent trigger wheel will cause the issue,he said no. Thats why i dont go to him anymore)
Previously my car was by Allen (ecu actually has his job number engraved) and Allen did the timing but when i pulled away it was pinging badly!
Reversed and he fiddled so we retarded the dizzy to get rid of the pinging .
I found out in Jan this year that he had fuel value on 250!!! just to get it to idle ok. So the guy brought it down to 150 (apparently 125 is where it should be).
Also,if you advance the dizzy physically but only very slightly,it makes a big "jump" and pings.
We actually drove my car with his laptop plugged in (this was now in Jan this year) and he said the timing all of a sudden jumped to a negative value while driving.
With that said,i bent the dizzy trigger wheel very close to perfect,but only after he had laptop on it.
I think maybe i should just make a plan and take it to him again and see what it does now. Maybe bending the trigger wheel right will now allow the ecu to recieve the cam timing properly.
The previous owner really pulled this car through his ass!!!! Numerous faults.
Sorry for long stories,i hope i simplified it so that u can understand what happening šŸ˜
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by Brandy01 »

I just had a look and the throttle lever does not have the fast shaking anymore. It is now more of a slow movement , like it's looking for the "idle point".
So i think i should make a plan to take my car in again and see if it is better and maybe correct now.
Something else i should look at?
Timing belt,pulleys,water pump etc etc have all been replaced,timing marks are all correct but there is one other thing. Not sure how much truth is in it,but apparently the aftermarket coolant temp sensors do not last long?
Should my car have 1 or 2 of them? Cabrio with aircon,according to Haynes,should have 2 inline. I have space for another and there is also an extra 4 pin connector not connected to anything,but i think this connector is for the aircon. Most of the aircon parts at the front are missing,condensor an aircon radiator an more
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by UDC »

Mp9 system only requires one 4pin water temp sensor.
Mp9 is very fussy with timing, set car on TDC, then put the Ecu into timing mode, the car will hold idle at 1500rpm when locked in timing mode, then use a timing light and adjust the timing to about 6 to 8 deg advance.
You also mention the car has a Polo cup map... most likely the timing and fueling values are advanced on that map, rather get a stock map if you want the car to behave smoothly
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by Brandy01 »

Yes it has the Polo Cup map.but at the time I was there, the damaged wires,trigger wheel etc had not been sorted so the high value was just to get the car to idle better
Other than Ross Tech and yourself,I have not seen anybody set the timing 100% correctly with the revs being up as well,thats the part most skip.
UDC thank you very very much for the help I REALLY appreciate it! It's gonna help me get some direction now with my car!
One last thing,by stock map do you mean the one the car came out with from VW?
If i decide on doing that ,who can i take it to in Cape Town,preferably northern suburbs if possible?
UDC
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by UDC »

Plenty forum guys here set the mp9 timing this way, this is where I learnt how to do it as well.

I am not too sure who else can assist with regards to remapping mp9 in Cpt, Allen is usually the go to guy in Cpt for this stuff.
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by Brandy01 »

Bad choice of wording on my oart, the 2 guys i have seen in Cape Town and a few on some forums.
Oh ok then I will speak to Allen,assumed he only did one kind.
Sorry if there is already a post about this but i really can't find any anywhere.
Why does the pcv valve on a VW have no internals? There is no spring or pintel (think this is
the correct name) inside and nothing anywhere in the pcv system which can regulate the flow.
Do you know? Or anybody else?
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by UDC »

we usually run the block breather pipe straight to oil catch can system, saves the TB from getting oiled up and dirty
Brandy01
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by Brandy01 »

Sorry i know this is the wrong section but i need to get this done likr NOW!!!
i forgot to remove the breaker bar from crank pulley centre bolt and tried to start my car and loosened the bolt. I torqued it to 200nm but need amother 1/2 turn (via a post of Panic) and i have only torqued and turned about a twelfth turn. i need to fetch my wife from work shortly. Is there an easy way besides removing the sump. My son is only 9 and cant press on brake pedal hard enough and neither pull hard enough on a wedged hammer on the inside of the flywheel
Any ideas please
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by UDC »

put the vehicle in gear...no.1 or reverse.....both front wheels have to be on the ground, put bricks around wheel to prevent it moving as well
if you torqued to 200nm already it should be fine...did you put lock tite as well
Brandy01
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by Brandy01 »

No i basically panicked because i know i must fetch my wife soon so i just tightened. But my neighbour just pulled in. Will ask him to stand on brakes. F@k weet. Peed off with myself
Brandy01
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by Brandy01 »

Got it about 2 thirds of a 1/4 turn now. Will just drive slow and be alert because its a second hand torque wrench,in very good condition but have not calibrated it yet. But i also set it a bit more than 200.
Will look later. Thank u for the reply!!!!!!
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Re: Need help - mp9 wiring

Post by DJBOOGZ »

Howzit UDC I'm new here sorry to just jump in but I'm absolutely lost with my car, it's a 98 GTi 2.0 mp9 stock, besides changing 4pin temp sensor,Map sensor, distributor.

Basically some time back my car was running dead, so I opted to change temperature sensor, no change with symptoms, tried my friends coil, no change. Then I changed the map sensor then the car came back to life but that only lasted for a month or so but the car was running very rich.

I don't have licensed copy of vag but I have the cable so the freeware don't show full info so I used a LAUNCH x431 to scan the car with the aftermarket map sensor it kept picking up short to ground /positive etc and the fueling was through the roof and so I fitted the old map sensor, adapted throttle and done a battery reset, cleared faults and reset again then started, it idles fine wasn't smelling rich so I drove it for 10 kms


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