Timing for dummies
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Timing for dummies
on the 8v motor i know that when i turn the dizzy the idle gets better or worse
Question is, could anyone explain in detail, how to do this properly, perhaps how to use a timing light properly, and how do you know if you are TDC, or 6 degrees tdc, or well any degree Tdc.
Should timing be done at certain intervals, if so how?
Something thats always puzzled me.
Any input would be appreciated
Regards
Shaun
Question is, could anyone explain in detail, how to do this properly, perhaps how to use a timing light properly, and how do you know if you are TDC, or 6 degrees tdc, or well any degree Tdc.
Should timing be done at certain intervals, if so how?
Something thats always puzzled me.
Any input would be appreciated
Regards
Shaun
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Re: Timing for dummies
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ignition_timingRezizter wrote:on the 8v motor i know that when i turn the dizzy the idle gets better or worse
Question is, could anyone explain in detail, how to do this properly, perhaps how to use a timing light properly, and how do you know if you are TDC, or 6 degrees tdc, or well any degree Tdc.
Should timing be done at certain intervals, if so how?
Something thats always puzzled me.
Any input would be appreciated
Regards
Shaun
His: '05 WRX STi, '98 356 Speedster Rep, '76 Dodge D100, '79 Golf LS
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Re: Timing for dummies
In short you should be messing with it. The timing on your car (I assume you're refering to the Velocity) is controlled by the EFI, thats why you don't have any advance mechanism on the distributer. There is a base timing setting which which is set at a specific engine RPM but once thats set you leave the distributer alone. Moving the distributer can mess up the fuel consumption and cause engine damaging detonation and rob you of performance
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Re: Timing for dummies
Fixed upneighbourhood terror wrote:In short you shouldn't be messing with it.
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Re: Timing for dummies
Ah yes ... thanksTorker wrote:Fixed upneighbourhood terror wrote:In short you shouldn't be messing with it.
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Re: Timing for dummies
neighbourhood, where do you get those renders from your sig?
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Re: Timing for dummies
From here > http://database.mangacars.fr/categories.php?cat_id=256dhirennaidoo wrote:neighbourhood, where do you get those renders from your sig?
Found one of a Mk1 then edited it to match my car
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Re: Timing for dummies
Thanks porno ster, exactly what i was looking for.
Shot for the help guys, good thing you told me about the efi... or else i would have had one broken little velo.
Fortunately i have a few mates with carb cars, so i'll practice my new found skills on their cars (i can see alot of people having to walk from next week
Regards
Shaun
Shot for the help guys, good thing you told me about the efi... or else i would have had one broken little velo.
Fortunately i have a few mates with carb cars, so i'll practice my new found skills on their cars (i can see alot of people having to walk from next week
Regards
Shaun
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Re: Timing for dummies
The reason the idling changes when you turn the distributor is because you are advancing and retarding the ignition timing.Rezizter wrote:on the 8v motor i know that when i turn the dizzy the idle gets better or worse
Question is, could anyone explain in detail, how to do this properly, perhaps how to use a timing light properly, and how do you know if you are TDC, or 6 degrees tdc, or well any degree Tdc.
Should timing be done at certain intervals, if so how?
Something thats always puzzled me.
Any input would be appreciated
Regards
Shaun
To set the timing on an 8V VW motor, you need to line up the 3 timing marks and then adjust the ignition timing using a timing light.
Lining up the 3 timing marks:
The mark on the cam pulley is a line on the inside of the pulley (facing the battery) and at TDC this mark must be level with the bottom of the tappet cover.
The rotor must point to the mark on the side of the distributor (you will need to take the plastic cover under the rotor off to see it).
There are 2 "flat pieces" on the flywheel and the mark you are looking for will be in between these 2 "flat pieces". This mark is either a punch mark (small round hole) and / or a v-type line cut into the flywheel and this mark must be in the middle of the inspection hole on the gearbox.
If you chose to use the punch mark (small round hole) then the motor is now at TDC. If you chose to use the V-type mark cut into the flywheel, then the motor is now at 6 degrees BTDC.
Adjusting the ignition timing:
Carb:
* Disconnect the vacuum pipe going to the vacuum advance unit on the distributor.
* Loosen the 13mm bolt that holds the clamp on the distributor shaft to prevent it from turning.
* If you used the punch mark (small round hole) then you will need an adjustable timing light and set it to 6 degrees advance. Then shoot the timing light at the mark on the flywheel and turn the distributor until the mark appears in the middle of the inspection hole.
* If you used the V-type mark cut into the flywheel, then you can use a static timing light, or an adjustable timing light set to 0 degrees. Then shoot the timing light at the mark on the flywheel and turn the distributor until the mark appears in the middle of the inspection hole.
* Tighten the 13mm bolt that holds the clamp on the distributor shaft to prevent it from turning.
MP9:
* You will need to get a VAG-COM, connect the diagnostic cable to the diagnostic port in your car and go to Group 1 under basic settings in the Engine menu. This will increase the revs to +- 1500rpm.
* Loosen the 13mm bolt that holds the clamp on the distributor shaft to prevent it from turning.
* If you used the punch mark (small round hole) then you will need an adjustable timing light and set it to 6 degrees advance. Then shoot the timing light at the mark on the flywheel and turn the distributor until the mark appears in the middle of the inspection hole.
* If you used the V-type mark cut into the flywheel, then you can use a static timing light, or an adjustable timing light set to 0 degrees. Then shoot the timing light at the mark on the flywheel and turn the distributor until the mark appears in the middle of the inspection hole.
* Tighten the 13mm bolt that holds the clamp on the distributor shaft to prevent it from turning.
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Re: Timing for dummies
gosh macman, thanks very much, thats exactly what i wanted to know.
Thanks again, brilliant write up.
Regards
Shaun
Thanks again, brilliant write up.
Regards
Shaun
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Re: Timing for dummies
Shot!neighbourhood terror wrote:From here > http://database.mangacars.fr/categories.php?cat_id=256dhirennaidoo wrote:neighbourhood, where do you get those renders from your sig?
Found one of a Mk1 then edited it to match my car
EDIT : They even had a pic of my classic!! Too wicked
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Re: Timing for dummies
U only line up all 3markings for cambelt changes or when u change cam to get belt on and have all 3 perfect again
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Re: Timing for dummies
I have a 1.8 golf 1 i took it in to replace the waterpump and the timing belt but now it wont start, the destributor is in line but im not sure how to align the pullies on witch the belt runs, please help.. im blank, tried everything my flat head could think of exept trying to align the pullies.. the top pulley has a mark on it but i dont see another mark on the engine like the bottom pulley has, i think that might be the problem but im not sure, pleassseeee
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Re: Timing for dummies
Sorrey for being a noob but if u use the 6° btdc mark on the crank pulley should'nt you have a 6°btdc mark on your cam pulley aswell?
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Re: Timing for dummies
Post number 9 has very clear guidelines.
1. The mark on the cam pulley must be at the bottom of the tappet cover, on the front of the engine ie. The radiator side.
2. The bellhousing has a pointer that the V slot on the flywheel must line up to.
3. The distributor has a small mark that the rotor must line up to
Edit. Never realize the date of this post.
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1. The mark on the cam pulley must be at the bottom of the tappet cover, on the front of the engine ie. The radiator side.
2. The bellhousing has a pointer that the V slot on the flywheel must line up to.
3. The distributor has a small mark that the rotor must line up to
Edit. Never realize the date of this post.
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Re: Timing for dummies
This states that the cam timing should be at tdc but you can use the v mark on the flywheel wich is 6°btdc as tdc on rhe crank. Does not make sence as pannic staded that the v mark is 10° btdc and if both rhe marks are present use the 0. If you think about it they should both allign. Both at tdc when you use a ajustable timing light and both at 6° btdc when using a static timing light.Ashveer03 wrote:Post number 9 has very clear guidelines.
1. The mark on the cam pulley must be at the bottom of the tappet cover, on the front of the engine ie. The radiator side.
2. The bellhousing has a pointer that the V slot on the flywheel must line up to.
3. The distributor has a small mark that the rotor must line up to
Edit. Never realize the date of this post.
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Re: Timing for dummies
I understand what u mean..
Basically setting the crank to the diamond v mark if its +-6 degrees and the cam to tdc will be incorrect cam to crank correlation.
Imo both should be at TDC.
It gets a little confusing because some flywheels dont have the dimple/punch mark, they just have the diamond V mark, and some dont have the diamond v mark. Some Aftermarket flywheels are also not made to spec at times.
What i personally do is,
1.Find crank tdc by my own means (get no1 piston to max height, make my own mark if theres a problem finding an "original" mark)
2. Set cam to tdc (i use the upper part of the cylinder head because its annoying to look at the bottom of the tappet cover)
3. Adjust the distributor to whatever the spec is.
People may disagree or trashtalk my method but it worked every time for me..
Guys with decades of experience on these engines will have proper bulletproof methods..
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Basically setting the crank to the diamond v mark if its +-6 degrees and the cam to tdc will be incorrect cam to crank correlation.
Imo both should be at TDC.
It gets a little confusing because some flywheels dont have the dimple/punch mark, they just have the diamond V mark, and some dont have the diamond v mark. Some Aftermarket flywheels are also not made to spec at times.
What i personally do is,
1.Find crank tdc by my own means (get no1 piston to max height, make my own mark if theres a problem finding an "original" mark)
2. Set cam to tdc (i use the upper part of the cylinder head because its annoying to look at the bottom of the tappet cover)
3. Adjust the distributor to whatever the spec is.
People may disagree or trashtalk my method but it worked every time for me..
Guys with decades of experience on these engines will have proper bulletproof methods..
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Re: Timing for dummies
Just what i was thinking. It just does'nt ad up accept if the one compensates for the other. Ie using the 0 mark on both and advancing the ignition to 6° and if you use the 6° btdc mark on the flywheel you need to set your ignition to 12° advance accept for the abcence of the 6°btdc mark on the cam pulley and the12° btdc on the flywheel.Ashveer03 wrote:I understand what u mean..
Basically setting the crank to the diamond v mark if its +-6 degrees and the cam to tdc will be incorrect cam to crank correlation.
Imo both should be at TDC.
It gets a little confusing because some flywheels dont have the dimple/punch mark, they just have the diamond V mark, and some dont have the diamond v mark. Some Aftermarket flywheels are also not made to spec at times.
What i personally do is,
1.Find crank tdc by my own means (get no1 piston to max height, make my own mark if theres a problem finding an "original" mark)
2. Set cam to tdc (i use the upper part of the cylinder head because its annoying to look at the bottom of the tappet cover)
3. Adjust the distributor to whatever the spec is.
People may disagree or trashtalk my method but it worked every time for me..
Guys with decades of experience on these engines will have proper bulletproof methods..
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OCD is not a disability is the ability to get it perfect
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Re: Timing for dummies
Just confusing. Use the 0 marker and that is that.Dub rox wrote:Just what i was thinking. It just does'nt ad up accept if the one compensates for the other. Ie using the 0 mark on both and advancing the ignition to 6° and if you use the 6° btdc mark on the flywheel you need to set your ignition to 12° advance accept for the abcence of the 6°btdc mark on the cam pulley and the12° btdc on the flywheel.Ashveer03 wrote:I understand what u mean..
Basically setting the crank to the diamond v mark if its +-6 degrees and the cam to tdc will be incorrect cam to crank correlation.
Imo both should be at TDC.
It gets a little confusing because some flywheels dont have the dimple/punch mark, they just have the diamond V mark, and some dont have the diamond v mark. Some Aftermarket flywheels are also not made to spec at times.
What i personally do is,
1.Find crank tdc by my own means (get no1 piston to max height, make my own mark if theres a problem finding an "original" mark)
2. Set cam to tdc (i use the upper part of the cylinder head because its annoying to look at the bottom of the tappet cover)
3. Adjust the distributor to whatever the spec is.
People may disagree or trashtalk my method but it worked every time for me..
Guys with decades of experience on these engines will have proper bulletproof methods..
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OCD is not a disability is the ability to get it perfect
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Re: Timing for dummies
Way i see it is it takes the signal from the hall sensor 6° to go from the dizzy to the ecu and then to the coilpack and all the way back to the dizzy at 1500rpm. Could be wrong.....Dub rox wrote:Just confusing. Use the 0 marker and that is that.Dub rox wrote:Just what i was thinking. It just does'nt ad up accept if the one compensates for the other. Ie using the 0 mark on both and advancing the ignition to 6° and if you use the 6° btdc mark on the flywheel you need to set your ignition to 12° advance accept for the abcence of the 6°btdc mark on the cam pulley and the12° btdc on the flywheel.Ashveer03 wrote:I understand what u mean..
Basically setting the crank to the diamond v mark if its +-6 degrees and the cam to tdc will be incorrect cam to crank correlation.
Imo both should be at TDC.
It gets a little confusing because some flywheels dont have the dimple/punch mark, they just have the diamond V mark, and some dont have the diamond v mark. Some Aftermarket flywheels are also not made to spec at times.
What i personally do is,
1.Find crank tdc by my own means (get no1 piston to max height, make my own mark if theres a problem finding an "original" mark)
2. Set cam to tdc (i use the upper part of the cylinder head because its annoying to look at the bottom of the tappet cover)
3. Adjust the distributor to whatever the spec is.
People may disagree or trashtalk my method but it worked every time for me..
Guys with decades of experience on these engines will have proper bulletproof methods..
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OCD is not a disability is the ability to get it perfect
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Re: Timing for dummies
What? Eish.
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Re: Timing for dummies
Or it could just be that it has to fire at 6° atdcpanic-mechanic wrote:What? Eish.
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Re: Timing for dummies
My point being that you can not use a static timing light on these motors?Dub rox wrote:Or it could just be that it has to fire at 6° atdcpanic-mechanic wrote:What? Eish.
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- Car Model: Citi sport 1.4i
Re: Timing for dummies
All melarkey aside now. Figured out why the 6°btdc mark is on the flywheel. It is there for setting the ignition timing. If you allign your tdc marks, the one on the camshaft pulley with the top of the head and the 0° on the flywheel, then your dizzy at no1. Fit your new belt. Tension it to be able to move 90° in both ways, not more not less, turn the engine anti clock wise till you allign the 6° btdc mark on the flywheel. Loosen the 13mm bolt holding the dizzy in place and turn the distributor body to allign the mark at the bottom wich indicates no1, tighten the bolt again, put the car in timing mode to referance with timing light and bobs your uncle, fanny's your aunt and fat larry your sister.Dub rox wrote:My point being that you can not use a static timing light on these motors?Dub rox wrote:Or it could just be that it has to fire at 6° atdcpanic-mechanic wrote:What? Eish.
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Ps: Provided that the first timing settings are done with the old belt still fitted and the timing was not out in any way.
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OCD is not a disability is the ability to get it perfect
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Re: Timing for dummies
There anyone in cape town that can do this for my 99 polo playa 1.6i?