Hx8 5W40 or Helix Ultra 5W40

[P1LAYA-ZN]

Good day gents,
So, battling to get info on the difference between the above and which is the better oil for a 1.8T
According to the spare shops, the ultra is discontinued and there is no differences with both being fully synthetic.
Does anyone know what's the difference or has anyone used both and noticed any differences in engine behaviour, engine noise, oil consumption, etc.

Thanks

[ICE King]

Hx8 was introduced in recent years , with it's introduction , killed the ultra sales as Hx8 is perfect for the modern boosted/NA cars and cheaper VS ultra being overpriced and more for race spec motors.

been using Hx8 in my tuned 1.8T for 30k km's , Dipstick is like 3/4 when I do a change at 14k km's ,Engine, turbo all sounds smooth, it's a darn good oil for it's price.

[rodga]

Goldwagen still had ultra a few weeks ago when I was there.

If you want some ultra and you close to Centurion, pm me



Sent from my MI 8 using Tapatalk

[VAG Fan]

What are the VW specs on the two oils?

[Hoosier Daddy]

HX8 trumps the ultra for modded cars.

[VAG Fan]

What are the VW specs on the two oils?

I also recently bought Ultra 5W-40 at GW. I had a look on the Shell SA website, where both are still listed.

Ultra: API SN/CF; ACEA A3/B3, A3/B4; BMW LL-01; MB approval 229.5, 226.5; VW 502.00/505.00; Porsche A40; Renault RN0700, RN0710; PSA B71 2296, Ferrari. Meets the requirements of Fiat 9.55535-Z2 and Chrysler MS-10725
HX8: API SN/CF; ACEA A3/B3, A3/B4; MB approval 229.3; VW 502.00/505.00; Renault RN0700, RN0710. Meets the requirements of Fiat 9.55535-N2 and 9.55535-M2

Both are fully synthetic. API, ACEA, Renault and VW specs are identical. In terms of other manufacturers, the Ultra seems to have higher / later specs. How the HX8 could trump the Ultra, I don't see.

[rodga]

What are the VW specs on the two oils?

I also recently bought Ultra 5W-40 at GW. I had a look on the Shell SA website, where both are still listed.

Ultra: API SN/CF; ACEA A3/B3, A3/B4; BMW LL-01; MB approval 229.5, 226.5; VW 502.00/505.00; Porsche A40; Renault RN0700, RN0710; PSA B71 2296, Ferrari. Meets the requirements of Fiat 9.55535-Z2 and Chrysler MS-10725
HX8: API SN/CF; ACEA A3/B3, A3/B4; MB approval 229.3; VW 502.00/505.00; Renault RN0700, RN0710. Meets the requirements of Fiat 9.55535-N2 and 9.55535-M2

Both are fully synthetic. API, ACEA, Renault and VW specs are identical. In terms of other manufacturers, the Ultra seems to have higher / later specs. How the HX8 could trump the Ultra, I don't see.

interesting that ferrari, bmw and porsche are approved on the ultra only. I thought it was just ferrari

[Hoosier Daddy]

What are the VW specs on the two oils?

I also recently bought Ultra 5W-40 at GW. I had a look on the Shell SA website, where both are still listed.

Ultra: API SN/CF; ACEA A3/B3, A3/B4; BMW LL-01; MB approval 229.5, 226.5; VW 502.00/505.00; Porsche A40; Renault RN0700, RN0710; PSA B71 2296, Ferrari. Meets the requirements of Fiat 9.55535-Z2 and Chrysler MS-10725
HX8: API SN/CF; ACEA A3/B3, A3/B4; MB approval 229.3; VW 502.00/505.00; Renault RN0700, RN0710. Meets the requirements of Fiat 9.55535-N2 and 9.55535-M2

Both are fully synthetic. API, ACEA, Renault and VW specs are identical. In terms of other manufacturers, the Ultra seems to have higher / later specs. How the HX8 could trump the Ultra, I don't see.

Personal experience - Ultra left a varnish on many motors that HX8 did not. In my own cars HX8 ran 5 degrees if not more cooler and maintained consistency a lot better through changes. If we work solely on manufacturer approval and data we should all be running Petronas or whatever the most expensive oil is currently - we also live in much warmer climates where cold flow properties matter a lot less (which is where manufacturers disprove oils mostly)

[Hoosier Daddy]

What are the VW specs on the two oils?

I also recently bought Ultra 5W-40 at GW. I had a look on the Shell SA website, where both are still listed.

Ultra: API SN/CF; ACEA A3/B3, A3/B4; BMW LL-01; MB approval 229.5, 226.5; VW 502.00/505.00; Porsche A40; Renault RN0700, RN0710; PSA B71 2296, Ferrari. Meets the requirements of Fiat 9.55535-Z2 and Chrysler MS-10725
HX8: API SN/CF; ACEA A3/B3, A3/B4; MB approval 229.3; VW 502.00/505.00; Renault RN0700, RN0710. Meets the requirements of Fiat 9.55535-N2 and 9.55535-M2

Both are fully synthetic. API, ACEA, Renault and VW specs are identical. In terms of other manufacturers, the Ultra seems to have higher / later specs. How the HX8 could trump the Ultra, I don't see.

interesting that ferrari, bmw and porsche are approved on the ultra only. I thought it was just ferrari

BMW also approves Castrol

[P1LAYA-ZN]

So HX8 it is
Oh and Ultra 5W40 is not discontinued as per some spare shops advice, as I have seen a few shops stocking both with HX8 being slightly cheaper.
None of the shops even knew what are the differences.

Thanks guys

[VAG Fan]

If we work solely on manufacturer approval and data we should all be running Petronas or whatever the most expensive oil is currently

Again, I don't follow you.
Do oil manufacturers "buy" approvals from car manufacturers?
Or are you saying that approvals have little meaning anyway?

Call me naive, but manufacturer approval is the first criterion I look at. I would like to think that manufacturer approvals are related to actual test results, and not to the price of the oil. And if two oils have the same spec that's correct for my car, I see no reason to buy the more expensive one.

[ICE King]

So HX8 it is
Oh and Ultra 5W40 is not discontinued as per some spare shops advice, as I have seen a few shops stocking both with HX8 being slightly cheaper.
None of the shops even knew what are the differences.

Thanks guys

You won't be disappointed + you'll have some extra cash in your pocket ,

Correct , Ultra was not discontinued , Hx8 just toke over it's sales.

[Hoosier Daddy]

If we work solely on manufacturer approval and data we should all be running Petronas or whatever the most expensive oil is currently

Again, I don't follow you.
Do oil manufacturers "buy" approvals from car manufacturers?
Or are you saying that approvals have little meaning anyway?

Call me naive, but manufacturer approval is the first criterion I look at. I would like to think that manufacturer approvals are related to actual test results, and not to the price of the oil. And if two oils have the same spec that's correct for my car, I see no reason to buy the more expensive one.

It ties into what was mentioned about cold temperature performance, and manufacturers do not approve oils based on cold temperature characteristics. Not about buying approvals, there was an article on Bob the oil guy (I think) about how pointless some standards differ to others. Magnatec makes many approvals, but few utilise it based on practical experience. Real world conditions - (tune, wear, climate, driving style) and experience in them will trump the testing methods any day in my mind. So it's best to speak to guys around the table before buying because there's a lot of knowledge in this forum and elsewhere.

[VAG Fan]

Agreed, there is much accumulated knowledge in forums, and it's always good to ask around and read as much as one can.

By the same token, there's probably even more disinformation, old myths, "accepted truths", subjective opinions and unfounded perceptions in forums. It's not always easy to decide in front of a screen which anonymous poster you trust and which one you don't.

Back to topic: I've always bought Ultra 5W40 at my local GW, because they never stocked HX8, and the Ultra at my GW is cheaper than HX8 is at other spares shops. (And because THE ONE forum member I probably trust most, recommended it to me.) If my GW guys have started stocking HX8, I'll probably give it a try with my next service.

[Kavi4GP]

If we work solely on manufacturer approval and data we should all be running Petronas or whatever the most expensive oil is currently

Again, I don't follow you.
Do oil manufacturers "buy" approvals from car manufacturers?
Or are you saying that approvals have little meaning anyway?

Call me naive, but manufacturer approval is the first criterion I look at. I would like to think that manufacturer approvals are related to actual test results, and not to the price of the oil. And if two oils have the same spec that's correct for my car, I see no reason to buy the more expensive one.

Generally they pay to get the testing done and approved, and pay a licence fee to keep the approval for marketing purposes.

You have to also note Full Synthetic and 100% Synthetic, there you paying for better additives and the whole amount of oil being processed vs a mixture of synthesised and base oils mixed in some ratio (non standard ratio across brands)

[VAG Fan]

The above terms specify the source of the base oil, not the additives.
"Synthetic", "fully synthetic", "100% synthetic" is a completely synthetic base oil.
"Synthetic technology", "semi-synthetic" etc. is a partially synthetic, blended base oil.
The rest, which either says "mineral" or nothing, is a mineral base oil.

All base oils, even the most rudimentary mineral ones, are then blended with additives, e.g. viscosity modifiers, friction reducers, acid neutralisers, etc.

[Abdullah]

I also struggled to find the ultra in my area, after numerous calls to different mechanics and spare shops i was assured the hx8 would be fine to use in my vehicle. Happy to say ive used it for the last 2 oil changes and everything seems perfectly fine.