Diesel Runaway
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Diesel Runaway
Hi Team
Took my 2006 Golf4 TDI 1.9 for major service (304000 KM, no problems)
Just got told that they had runaway when they put it on DYNO ...Engin Blow up !
I know diesel engine can runaway for various reasons, and there is ways to stop the runaway
Question ? (Please advise)
What is the procedure for runaway on DYNO, and could it be prevented ?
Took my 2006 Golf4 TDI 1.9 for major service (304000 KM, no problems)
Just got told that they had runaway when they put it on DYNO ...Engin Blow up !
I know diesel engine can runaway for various reasons, and there is ways to stop the runaway
Question ? (Please advise)
What is the procedure for runaway on DYNO, and could it be prevented ?
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Re: Diesel Runaway
Ryan Demoser
1996 Mk3 Golf VR6
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1996 Mk3 Golf VR6
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Re: Diesel Runaway
Did you remove the ASR/ASV? Once the car is switched off the ASR/ASV should close the intake and starve the engine of air.
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Re: Diesel Runaway
Was there any issues regarding smoke from the exhaust? Particularly white
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- panic-mechanic
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Re: Diesel Runaway
why would you run a car on the dyno for a service?.
But it is pretty simple. Switch it off or put your foot on the brake and press the dyno brake. It will drag it dead.
Can't really prevent it, turbo failure causes it.
But it is pretty simple. Switch it off or put your foot on the brake and press the dyno brake. It will drag it dead.
Can't really prevent it, turbo failure causes it.
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Re: Diesel Runaway
Diesel runaway is when the engine continues running after its switched off using its own oil as fuel. If there is excessive blowby from the cylinders or, as Panic mentioned, bad turbo, the hot oil rich air is good enough to fuel a diesel engine. It will simply rev out until it destroys itself. Not to much can be done to stop it once it happens. I bet that there were signs that could have been picked up that could have prevented it, but the cause of the problem came long before the event.
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Re: Diesel Runaway
As I said before the brakes are quite sufficient to stop the runaway. You keep it in gear and stand on the brake till it dies. I have had it twice in that exact same model ie golf 4 tdi and simply dragging it to a stop on the brakes works perfectly fine. That engine does not make more hp ( and it makes even less with the blown turbo) than what the brakes can provide in stopping force. But people panic instead of just thinking and acting properly. So the first thing they do is step on the clutch which it the last thing you should do.
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Re: Diesel Runaway
No, stock standard no modifications ever done to the car.Neuk wrote:Did you remove the ASR/ASV? Once the car is switched off the ASR/ASV should close the intake and starve the engine of air.
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Re: Diesel Runaway
NO, just the normal black smoke when acceleratingDietermk4 wrote:Was there any issues regarding smoke from the exhaust? Particularly white
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Re: Diesel Runaway
I would have thought that with the ASR/ASV in place the engine would have been starved of air and die but maybe there are other issues.DjC wrote:No, stock standard no modifications ever done to the car.Neuk wrote:Did you remove the ASR/ASV? Once the car is switched off the ASR/ASV should close the intake and starve the engine of air.
Current Garage:
Daily Drive: 2014 VW Touareg 3.0 V6 TDi R-Line
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Vagon: 2005 Audi B6 A4 1.8T (140kw) Avant
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Weekend Warrior: 1993 Volkswagen Caddy 2.0 16v ABF on ITB's
Daily Drive: 2014 VW Touareg 3.0 V6 TDi R-Line
Project Fes: 1982 VW Golf GLS 1.5
Project FeO: 1966 VW Type 2 Transporter Kombi Split Window
Previous Garage:
Roxy: 2015 VW Golf R
Vagon: 2005 Audi B6 A4 1.8T (140kw) Avant
Project XXXX: 1967 VW Type 3 Variant (Squareback)
Project Betty: 2005 Polo 1.9 TDI (PD130) Sportline
Weekend Warrior: 1993 Volkswagen Caddy 2.0 16v ABF on ITB's
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Re: Diesel Runaway
Thanks for the explanation, i was about to ask the question.missioner wrote:Diesel runaway is when the engine continues running after its switched off using its own oil as fuel. If there is excessive blowby from the cylinders or, as Panic mentioned, bad turbo, the hot oil rich air is good enough to fuel a diesel engine. It will simply rev out until it destroys itself. Not to much can be done to stop it once it happens. I bet that there were signs that could have been picked up that could have prevented it, but the cause of the problem came long before the event.
THANAS wrote:Mix them together to create Shellstrol, and then mix that with Winstrol to create the ultimate, maximum performance oil for your engine.
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Re: Diesel Runaway
Lmao, weird af to put a car on a dyno after a major service, usually you just go drive it in normal operating conditions for a while, but my bet is (due to the mileage ) the turbo seals were reaching their expected life expectancy and fed the engine oil until it ran out of that into catastrophic failure. Bad luck, but I would challenge the service centre on the matter.
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Re: Diesel Runaway
Stuff the intake to starve it , saves drivetrain stress
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- panic-mechanic
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Re: Diesel Runaway
My guess is you have never had this happen yet? It happens faster than you can say runaway.. By the time you have brought to a standstill if you put it in neutral and get out to stuuf the intake the motor would have long time grenaded.....
Stephan van Tonder - Jhb - Putfontein Benoni
'05 Audi A6 3.0L TDI Avant
'09 Touareg 3l TDI
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'09 Touareg 3l TDI
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'05 Touareg v10
Perfect Power dealer. I do dyno tuning.
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Re: Diesel Runaway
The real question still remain, WTF was the car on a dyno? If this happend on a dyno I am right if I say it could / would have happened anytime any where?
- panic-mechanic
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Re: Diesel Runaway
Yes just unfortunate. Dyno don't place more load on a car but you do tend to rev it slightly higher than it might see everyday. Could have just been the unlucky last straw. That they then did not handle the runaway is the really unfortunate bit
Stephan van Tonder - Jhb - Putfontein Benoni
'05 Audi A6 3.0L TDI Avant
'09 Touareg 3l TDI
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Perfect Power dealer. I do dyno tuning.
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'05 Touareg v10
Perfect Power dealer. I do dyno tuning.
- Tdi jetta 4 ever
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Re: Diesel Runaway
It might be one of those performance service centers then.
Robin
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Re: Diesel Runaway
Hi all
Being a qualified mechanic and Master technician we have developed a safety system for run away diesel engines. This was developed for the mining industry where we shut the engine down in this situation. Turbo charger wear is the most common fault on run a way engines. we still produce kits for this application.
Regards
Ivan
Being a qualified mechanic and Master technician we have developed a safety system for run away diesel engines. This was developed for the mining industry where we shut the engine down in this situation. Turbo charger wear is the most common fault on run a way engines. we still produce kits for this application.
Regards
Ivan
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Re: Diesel Runaway
Keen to see that safety system, can u share any info?
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Re: Diesel Runaway
I had a runaway a few months back. I just switched it off. Luckily my shut off valve still worked.
Robin
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Re: Diesel Runaway
Several people in this thread have been asking about the shut-off valve. Agreed, when it operates, it completely shuts off the inlet manifold. But, to my knowledge, it only does so for a second or two, to kill the engine on a normal switch-off. After that, it actually re-opens, ready for the next engine start. You can observe this when switching the AHF off.
So, if a runaway engine was switched off at high revs but is still moving after the valve has closed and re-opened, it would just pick up speed and run away again.
Robin, I presume in your case the engine fortunately came to a complete stand-still before the valve re-opened.
So, if a runaway engine was switched off at high revs but is still moving after the valve has closed and re-opened, it would just pick up speed and run away again.
Robin, I presume in your case the engine fortunately came to a complete stand-still before the valve re-opened.
Mark R.
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2004 VW Golf TDI, type 1J, AHF, 317k (2016-current) --- daily
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Previous:
1992 Audi 500 SE, type C4, AAR (2001-2020) --- nice while it lasted
1983 VW Golf GTS, type 17, FR (1992-2005) --- most fun car I've ever had
1978 Audi 100 GLS 5E, type 43, WC (1991-92) --- died in the side of a Rekord who cut me off
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2004 VW Golf TDI, type 1J, AHF, 317k (2016-current) --- daily
1990 VW Fox, type 16, HM, 304k (2005-current) --- spare runaround
Previous:
1992 Audi 500 SE, type C4, AAR (2001-2020) --- nice while it lasted
1983 VW Golf GTS, type 17, FR (1992-2005) --- most fun car I've ever had
1978 Audi 100 GLS 5E, type 43, WC (1991-92) --- died in the side of a Rekord who cut me off
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- MarshallGTi
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Re: Diesel Runaway
I could be wrong, but on the 96kw motors the ASV stays closed until the ecu reads 0rpm. Its not there as a shut off valve, but rather an anti-shudder valve to kill the engine quicker and thus less rocking motion and vibrations for you to feel in the cabin.
It is an ingenius solution to a problem that should have never existed in the 1st place...
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EX-DOHCTOR wrote: I'd make sure I understand the differences between fish and engine components before attempting any modifications on my motor vehicle as a start.
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Re: Diesel Runaway
I was thinking along the same lines.. thats the reason its called an anti shudder valve and not an engine shut of valve lol.MarshallGTi wrote:I could be wrong, but on the 96kw motors the ASV stays closed until the ecu reads 0rpm. Its not there as a shut off valve, but rather an anti-shudder valve to kill the engine quicker and thus less rocking motion and vibrations for you to feel in the cabin.
A tuner might be able to tell us how the asv works? Whether its linked to rpm or whether its a timed function..
I did notice that whenever u shut off the engine, the asv stays closed for a second or 2 after the engine has shut off
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Re: Diesel Runaway
Would the ECU still monitor rpm if the ignition is switched off anyways? Does the ECU even get power?
Mark R.
- - - - - - - - - -
2004 VW Golf TDI, type 1J, AHF, 317k (2016-current) --- daily
1990 VW Fox, type 16, HM, 304k (2005-current) --- spare runaround
Previous:
1992 Audi 500 SE, type C4, AAR (2001-2020) --- nice while it lasted
1983 VW Golf GTS, type 17, FR (1992-2005) --- most fun car I've ever had
1978 Audi 100 GLS 5E, type 43, WC (1991-92) --- died in the side of a Rekord who cut me off
- - - - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - - - -
2004 VW Golf TDI, type 1J, AHF, 317k (2016-current) --- daily
1990 VW Fox, type 16, HM, 304k (2005-current) --- spare runaround
Previous:
1992 Audi 500 SE, type C4, AAR (2001-2020) --- nice while it lasted
1983 VW Golf GTS, type 17, FR (1992-2005) --- most fun car I've ever had
1978 Audi 100 GLS 5E, type 43, WC (1991-92) --- died in the side of a Rekord who cut me off
- - - - - - - - - -