Headlight restoration

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SHAUN
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Headlight restoration

Post by SHAUN »

Hi guys,

Looking at doing a headlight restoration,

How is everyone's experience with the Shield kit?

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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by Stompie »

does that come with the sealant/UV protection stuff you put on afterwards cause otherwise its going to turn yellow from what ive seen
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by keval »

Wouldn't it be cheaper to give it to one of the detailers here that has the proper uv sealing stuff. u can actually use different grit sandpaper to remove the oxidation and polish it with a compound.....the main trick here is to keep it that way with the sealer.
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by lawrence »

Shaun, I've never used that kit but can make a few quick comments.

1. I am not sure what grit the supplied sandpaper is
2. I have no idea how aggressive the supplied polish is
3. The supplied wool pad looks like it goes on the back of a drill
4. I can almost guarantee you if any form of sealant (protection) is supplied, it will NOT be enough to adequately protect the lights

Looking at each of the above in a little more detail.

1. Required sand paper 'grits' for a full headlight restoration are typically starting at around 800 grit to ensure all of the original OEM coating on the headlight is sanded off, and will be followed by 1000/1500/2000/2500 and maybe even 3000. As I am sure you understand, if the supplied grits are not low enough, you will never get the OEM coating off, and if they only supply low grits then you will be leaving some heavy sanding marks in the lights.

2. IF you intend on spraying your own clear back over the lens for protection, a polish isn't needed as you would sand the headlight with say 1500 grit to allow some 'tooth' for the paint to bond to - the paint will self level leaving perfectly finished lights... however; if you decide not to repaint with clear and intend on applying some other form of protection, you will then need to polish out the sanding marks, and I just don't know if the supplied polish is up to the task

3. Polishing with a wool pad and a rotary (drill) will leave buffer trails which will then need to be polished out using a dual action machine of some sort. If you are going to use a drill, make sure you start off (and preferably stay) on a low speed. High speed on a rotary is a recipe for excess heat and buffer trails.

4. To prevent the polycarbonate from re-yellowing post sanding off the OEM film, you are going to have to use something durable (even durable paint sealants aren't really up to the task) and the first prize would be to re-clear using a quality clear with UV blockers in it. Second prize would be either a dedicate lens coating (Optimum makes a product called Opti-lens but its not available locally, and prices out the states with shipping are eye-watering). Then there is the 'homebrew' that myself and others like Etienne use, which should see at least a year to 2 of protection from re-yellowing - as it is a home brew that Etienne shared with me, I am not comfortable sharing the recipe without his consent perhaps PM him?). Lastly you can go with a quality paint sealant but it is going to require very frequent re-application.

Having said all of that, what is it exactly you are trying to achieve by 'restoring' the lights... in other words, what are the problems with the light:

a) swirls can mostly be polished out without sanding, if the OEM coating IS still in tact - aggressive polishing is not recommended as it will thin out the coating, but light polishing is acceptable
b) yellowing of the lights usually occurs once the OEM film has failed - in these case you must sand off all of the coating
c) deeper scratches/pitting will typically require the removal of the OEM film, BUT, if the film is still in tact you really need to decide if it is worth it as removal of the deeper defects is going to require the removal of the OEM film, which then brings you back to the concern of how to protect them.

If I may ask, what is the kit retailing for?
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by SHAUN »

lawrence wrote:Shaun, I've never used that kit but can make a few quick comments.

1. I am not sure what grit the supplied sandpaper is
2. I have no idea how aggressive the supplied polish is
3. The supplied wool pad looks like it goes on the back of a drill
4. I can almost guarantee you if any form of sealant (protection) is supplied, it will NOT be enough to adequately protect the lights

Looking at each of the above in a little more detail.

1. Required sand paper 'grits' for a full headlight restoration are typically starting at around 800 grit to ensure all of the original OEM coating on the headlight is sanded off, and will be followed by 1000/1500/2000/2500 and maybe even 3000. As I am sure you understand, if the supplied grits are not low enough, you will never get the OEM coating off, and if they only supply low grits then you will be leaving some heavy sanding marks in the lights.

2. IF you intend on spraying your own clear back over the lens for protection, a polish isn't needed as you would sand the headlight with say 1500 grit to allow some 'tooth' for the paint to bond to - the paint will self level leaving perfectly finished lights... however; if you decide not to repaint with clear and intend on applying some other form of protection, you will then need to polish out the sanding marks, and I just don't know if the supplied polish is up to the task

3. Polishing with a wool pad and a rotary (drill) will leave buffer trails which will then need to be polished out using a dual action machine of some sort. If you are going to use a drill, make sure you start off (and preferably stay) on a low speed. High speed on a rotary is a recipe for excess heat and buffer trails.

4. To prevent the polycarbonate from re-yellowing post sanding off the OEM film, you are going to have to use something durable (even durable paint sealants aren't really up to the task) and the first prize would be to re-clear using a quality clear with UV blockers in it. Second prize would be either a dedicate lens coating (Optimum makes a product called Opti-lens but its not available locally, and prices out the states with shipping are eye-watering). Then there is the 'homebrew' that myself and others like Etienne use, which should see at least a year to 2 of protection from re-yellowing - as it is a home brew that Etienne shared with me, I am not comfortable sharing the recipe without his consent perhaps PM him?). Lastly you can go with a quality paint sealant but it is going to require very frequent re-application.

Having said all of that, what is it exactly you are trying to achieve by 'restoring' the lights... in other words, what are the problems with the light:

a) swirls can mostly be polished out without sanding, if the OEM coating IS still in tact - aggressive polishing is not recommended as it will thin out the coating, but light polishing is acceptable
b) yellowing of the lights usually occurs once the OEM film has failed - in these case you must sand off all of the coating
c) deeper scratches/pitting will typically require the removal of the OEM film, BUT, if the film is still in tact you really need to decide if it is worth it as removal of the deeper defects is going to require the removal of the OEM film, which then brings you back to the concern of how to protect them.

If I may ask, what is the kit retailing for?
Thank you very much for the detailed explanation, was also thinking that sanding and clearcoat will be the way to go.

The kit retails for R250, so was not expecting the best results, will rather go the clearcoat route.

The headlights have sandblast marks en some discoloration.
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by 1naid »

Also interested in this restoration as I have almost completely dull lights.

I have read this and guys are claiming good results:
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/sho ... -idea.html

Cause the sealant they use looks like a wood sealer of some sort - http://5series.net/forums/diy-do-yourse ... 931/page2/

So SA equivalent would be something like - http://www.woodoc.com/products/3 I just can't seem to find an outdoor alterntive.

And a TBT Thread links up to the one above from autogeek - http://www.vwclub.co.za/forum/viewtopic ... 4&start=25

Shield Kit on special:
http://www.takealot.com/pool-garden/all ... dt=23&_r=1

Shaun, please share the chosen method.
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by GaVeN »

lawrence wrote:Shaun, I've never used that kit but can make a few quick comments.

1. I am not sure what grit the supplied sandpaper is
2. I have no idea how aggressive the supplied polish is
3. The supplied wool pad looks like it goes on the back of a drill
4. I can almost guarantee you if any form of sealant (protection) is supplied, it will NOT be enough to adequately protect the lights

Looking at each of the above in a little more detail.

1. Required sand paper 'grits' for a full headlight restoration are typically starting at around 800 grit to ensure all of the original OEM coating on the headlight is sanded off, and will be followed by 1000/1500/2000/2500 and maybe even 3000. As I am sure you understand, if the supplied grits are not low enough, you will never get the OEM coating off, and if they only supply low grits then you will be leaving some heavy sanding marks in the lights.

2. IF you intend on spraying your own clear back over the lens for protection, a polish isn't needed as you would sand the headlight with say 1500 grit to allow some 'tooth' for the paint to bond to - the paint will self level leaving perfectly finished lights... however; if you decide not to repaint with clear and intend on applying some other form of protection, you will then need to polish out the sanding marks, and I just don't know if the supplied polish is up to the task

3. Polishing with a wool pad and a rotary (drill) will leave buffer trails which will then need to be polished out using a dual action machine of some sort. If you are going to use a drill, make sure you start off (and preferably stay) on a low speed. High speed on a rotary is a recipe for excess heat and buffer trails.

4. To prevent the polycarbonate from re-yellowing post sanding off the OEM film, you are going to have to use something durable (even durable paint sealants aren't really up to the task) and the first prize would be to re-clear using a quality clear with UV blockers in it. Second prize would be either a dedicate lens coating (Optimum makes a product called Opti-lens but its not available locally, and prices out the states with shipping are eye-watering). Then there is the 'homebrew' that myself and others like Etienne use, which should see at least a year to 2 of protection from re-yellowing - as it is a home brew that Etienne shared with me, I am not comfortable sharing the recipe without his consent perhaps PM him?). Lastly you can go with a quality paint sealant but it is going to require very frequent re-application.

Having said all of that, what is it exactly you are trying to achieve by 'restoring' the lights... in other words, what are the problems with the light:

a) swirls can mostly be polished out without sanding, if the OEM coating IS still in tact - aggressive polishing is not recommended as it will thin out the coating, but light polishing is acceptable
b) yellowing of the lights usually occurs once the OEM film has failed - in these case you must sand off all of the coating
c) deeper scratches/pitting will typically require the removal of the OEM film, BUT, if the film is still in tact you really need to decide if it is worth it as removal of the deeper defects is going to require the removal of the OEM film, which then brings you back to the concern of how to protect them.

If I may ask, what is the kit retailing for?
What he said :iagree:

Another alternative, which I use, is to seal the lights after polishing with a sealant like Collinite, and then applying a clear film such as Lamin-x.
Clearcoat will eventually also get sandblasted, and start pitting, and eventually peel off again, having you red the entire process again in a few months. Whereas with the film, when it gets pitted, pull it off, and re-apply a fresh one.
The film will take all of the beating like UV, sand blasting, pitting etc. and is cheap as chips in comparison to the other alternatives.
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by Deranged_9n3 »

Shaun those kits are utter sh!t. It has 1200 gritt sanding paper that is IMO far more aggro than 1200 gritt. Also, no ranging your sanding at all. Had a client properly **** up his headights with that so I bought a kit and tried it out since I couldn't believe it. Stay away !!!

If it has stonechips, you're going to battle, but it can be sorted. Not 100% depending on how deep the pit marks are, but way better !

@1naid - ah the good ol hellmsman spar method ! VERY informative post. You are on the right track with the replacement product but not quite. It's not THAT simple findimg a replacement product

If anyone wants to do their headlights and have me apply my UV coating I'll do it for free for you. Otherwise I charge R450 for a restoration on faded lights and R650 for stonechipped lights
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by Tashveer »

I found this online, it's a nice little step by step guide.
I'm hoping Lawrence and Etienne could provide more info on the UV Coating/Sealing?

What exactly are those chemicals and are they good enough?
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by Deranged_9n3 »

Tashveer wrote:I found this online, it's a nice little step by step guide.
I'm hoping Lawrence and Etienne could provide more info on the UV Coating/Sealing?

What exactly are those chemicals and are they good enough?
Well I am not comfortable with sharing my method :shock: I spent aaaaaaaaages doing research and testing the products to find a sollution that works. Like I said, if you need the product, restore your lights and I'll UV coat it for free but I'm not comfortable handing out my recipe. I won't promise you a period of time that it is gona last, situations etc plays a major role, but lets just say I have used my method for +- 40 months without a comeback :grin:
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by Tashveer »

Deranged_9n3 wrote:
Tashveer wrote:I found this online, it's a nice little step by step guide.
I'm hoping Lawrence and Etienne could provide more info on the UV Coating/Sealing?

What exactly are those chemicals and are they good enough?
Well I am not comfortable with sharing my method :shock: I spent aaaaaaaaages doing research and testing the products to find a sollution that works. Like I said, if you need the product, restore your lights and I'll UV coat it for free but I'm not comfortable handing out my recipe. I won't promise you a period of time that it is gona last, situations etc plays a major role, but lets just say I have used my method for +- 40 months without a comeback :grin:
Lol, sorry bud i didn't mean sharing your own personal method but referring to the method in the link which i forgot to attach...here it is...

http://www.instructables.com/id/How-to- ... /?ALLSTEPS
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by Deranged_9n3 »

Tashveer wrote:
Deranged_9n3 wrote:
Tashveer wrote:I found this online, it's a nice little step by step guide.
I'm hoping Lawrence and Etienne could provide more info on the UV Coating/Sealing?

What exactly are those chemicals and are they good enough?
Well I am not comfortable with sharing my method :shock: I spent aaaaaaaaages doing research and testing the products to find a sollution that works. Like I said, if you need the product, restore your lights and I'll UV coat it for free but I'm not comfortable handing out my recipe. I won't promise you a period of time that it is gona last, situations etc plays a major role, but lets just say I have used my method for +- 40 months without a comeback :grin:
Lol, sorry bud i didn't mean sharing your own personal method but referring to the method in the link which i forgot to attach...here it is...

http://www.instructables.com/id/How-to- ... /?ALLSTEPS
Very nice informative post :hurray: :hurray: though I can't confirm the UV coat :cry:
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by 1naid »

Deranged we can make moola and patent your mix, hahahah.

Only problem is to find the South African equivalent to the stuff the US okes use. What do we use in SA for hellmsman spar and the shop towel, I have found the mineral spirits.

But then like Gaven said restore them and wrap them clear LaminX.
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by DINODENASH »

Most new cars lenses are made up of plastic am I right ?
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by GaVeN »

DINODENASH wrote:Most new cars lenses are made up of plastic am I right ?
Correct :wink:
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by DINODENASH »

GaVeN wrote:
DINODENASH wrote:Most new cars lenses are made up of plastic am I right ?
Correct :wink:
cool, will the same process apply for glass units ?
like my corsa
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by lawrence »

DINODENASH wrote:
GaVeN wrote:
DINODENASH wrote:Most new cars lenses are made up of plastic am I right ?
Correct :wink:
cool, will the same process apply for glass units ?
like my corsa
I would say NO

Glass is so much harder than plastic - hell it is so much harder than paint (you could polish your glass with a heavy compound and it would only remove dirt OFF the glass - it would not even touch removing scratches IN the glass) and so any attempts at removing below surface defects out of glass are going to require some specialized products.

First you will need cerium oxide which can be bought in powder form off the net and mixed yourself, or can be purchased in ready to use form like Carpro Ceriglass polish. You will then need to combine that with probably a Rayon pad (Carpro) and a rotary. Even with the above products/tools expect a lot of messy work...

If I recall correctly Pitzi has some glass polishing done recently and landed up forking out some serious moolah due to the specialized nature of glass polishing, which if done incorrectly can lead to things like the glass having optical distortions etc.
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by GaVeN »

lawrence wrote:
DINODENASH wrote:
GaVeN wrote:
DINODENASH wrote:Most new cars lenses are made up of plastic am I right ?
Correct :wink:
cool, will the same process apply for glass units ?
like my corsa
I would say NO

Glass is so much harder than plastic - hell it is so much harder than paint (you could polish your glass with a heavy compound and it would only remove dirt OFF the glass - it would not even touch removing scratches IN the glass) and so any attempts at removing below surface defects out of glass are going to require some specialized products.

First you will need cerium oxide which can be bought in powder form off the net and mixed yourself, or can be purchased in ready to use form like Carpro Ceriglass polish. You will then need to combine that with probably a Rayon pad (Carpro) and a rotary. Even with the above products/tools expect a lot of messy work...

If I recall correctly Pitzi has some glass polishing done recently and landed up forking out some serious moolah due to the specialized nature of glass polishing, which if done incorrectly can lead to things like the glass having optical distortions etc.
:iagree:

It is something truly hectic & specialised.
And, takes a lot ofexperience & skill to do.
I've tried my hand at smoothing out a set of Jetta 3 headlights, where I wanted to remove the factory lines to install projectors into them...Needless to say, 2 sets of headlights, products, how-to's, research & a lot of shattered glass later, I abandoned the project.
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by DINODENASH »

wow !
thanks Lawrence & Gaven
very interesting
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Re: Headlight restoration

Post by Deranged_9n3 »

For my cyclo machine I have special pads for glass that I use to remove water spots caused by boreholes etc. trust me, glass is a PITA believe you for me
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