Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

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RJ8V
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Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by RJ8V »

Good morning Gents,

Getting pretty tired hammering on same subject for a couple of days. But still can't seem to get my timing perfect. Starting to think I'm either slow or just missing the big "o".

Redid the timing on my 2005 vw Chico 1.4 Carb.

Most forums regarding the flywheel marks, they explain there is 2 marks TDC(small round notch) and either left or right a v-type for 6BTDC now I've been thru my flywheel.

I do see both marks. V-type mark (6BTDC) and underneath is the notch (TDC) how is that even possible?

Now I'm not sure is it at TDC or BTDC.

Camshaft mark lines up with bottom of tappet cover, rotor lines up with punched line for cylinder #1 and since flywheel's marks are on top of one another, it's lined up as well.

Started car, used advance timing light to fine tuned. at 3btdc (Factory setting) car idles too low, at 6btdc it idles normal but not pulling, dead spots when accelerating.

What the hell am i missing???

2005 Chico 1.4 carb 8v with newer type distributor(no vacuum dizzy)

Please guys help me sort this sh#t out once and for all, seriously getting moerig here
EX: '02 AUDI A3 1.8 20V
EX: '81 Golf Rabbit Mk1, 2e 8V MP9. Not self-Build.
EX: '05 Ford Fiesta ST 2.0 Normal Aspirated
EX: '06 Volvo S60 D5
EX: '79 Golf MK1 2Door, 1.6i MP9. Not self-Build
EX: '05 Golf Chico 1.4 Carb - Self- Project

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Torker
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Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by Torker »

What I always do to make sure I use the right (TDC) flywheel mark, is stick a long screwdriver in the spark plug hole on #1 cylinder and turn the crank until you can feel the screwdriver is at the highest point. Check which mark on the flywheel corresponds and mark it with white paint.
Current rides:

VW Golf - 83 GT 2.1 16V 2-door with throttles
VW Golf - 78 LS 2.0 8V 4-door (2.1 ABF with throttles in progress)
VW Golf - '08 Citi Storm - 1.4 for now
Hyundai - 1.4 Getz (daily)
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RJ8V
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Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by RJ8V »

Thanks Torker,

Still doesn't make sense why the 2 marks aren't separate or next to each other but on top of one another.

Will try with the screqw driver, but should I assume then it's TDC or BTDC since the marks are not separate?
EX: '02 AUDI A3 1.8 20V
EX: '81 Golf Rabbit Mk1, 2e 8V MP9. Not self-Build.
EX: '05 Ford Fiesta ST 2.0 Normal Aspirated
EX: '06 Volvo S60 D5
EX: '79 Golf MK1 2Door, 1.6i MP9. Not self-Build
EX: '05 Golf Chico 1.4 Carb - Self- Project

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Torker
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Posts: 9591
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Car Model: Golf GT
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Location: Springs

Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by Torker »

Rynard wrote:Thanks Torker,

Still doesn't make sense why the 2 marks aren't separate or next to each other but on top of one another.

Will try with the screqw driver, but should I assume then it's TDC or BTDC since the marks are not separate?
It seems OEM/aftermarket flywheels have different methods of marking the flywheel, if you use the screwdriver and you are sure it's at the highest point that will be TDC and you can mark it as such.
Current rides:

VW Golf - 83 GT 2.1 16V 2-door with throttles
VW Golf - 78 LS 2.0 8V 4-door (2.1 ABF with throttles in progress)
VW Golf - '08 Citi Storm - 1.4 for now
Hyundai - 1.4 Getz (daily)
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missioner
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Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by missioner »

I saw the same thing on a similar car the other day.

Set your timing light to zero before setting the timing, that way when the groove is lined up with the arrow on the bell housing you can safely say the timing is at 3°
'87 Golf 1 Olde Skewl OEM+
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panic-mechanic
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Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by panic-mechanic »

You can also check it against the marks on the front pulley and tappet cover.
3 degrees sounds very slow though.
There could also be other issues causing the dead spot not just timing.
Stephan van Tonder - Jhb - Putfontein Benoni
'05 Audi A6 3.0L TDI Avant
'09 Touareg 3l TDI
'13 VW CC 2l tdi (repair project)
'05 Touareg v10

Perfect Power dealer. I do dyno tuning.
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RJ8V
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Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by RJ8V »

Thanx for the info guys.

Will redo the whole process this afternoon. And sice both marks on flywheel are in same position. I will asume itd tdc (confirming with screw driver)

Panic what else can be the problem, of the timing is set correct agian? Or what else can I start looking at if it is still the same?
EX: '02 AUDI A3 1.8 20V
EX: '81 Golf Rabbit Mk1, 2e 8V MP9. Not self-Build.
EX: '05 Ford Fiesta ST 2.0 Normal Aspirated
EX: '06 Volvo S60 D5
EX: '79 Golf MK1 2Door, 1.6i MP9. Not self-Build
EX: '05 Golf Chico 1.4 Carb - Self- Project

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Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by panic-mechanic »

Spark plugs, leads, carb acceleraror pump, float level many many things.
Stephan van Tonder - Jhb - Putfontein Benoni
'05 Audi A6 3.0L TDI Avant
'09 Touareg 3l TDI
'13 VW CC 2l tdi (repair project)
'05 Touareg v10

Perfect Power dealer. I do dyno tuning.
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RJ8V
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Car Model: BT 50 3.2 SLE 4x2
Location: Mpumalanga, Middelburg

Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by RJ8V »

So I've aligned camshaft mark, rotor and flywheel.

Turned a few times to make sure, then I started the car, idling was bad almost died. I didn't use the timing light yet to adjust. Couldn't see the mark line up with the bell housing mark.

So I had to turn the distributor almost halfway before I started to see the mark on the flywheel.

Is this normal? Wasn't I suppose to see the mark directly more or less when timing light is flashing and then adjust?
EX: '02 AUDI A3 1.8 20V
EX: '81 Golf Rabbit Mk1, 2e 8V MP9. Not self-Build.
EX: '05 Ford Fiesta ST 2.0 Normal Aspirated
EX: '06 Volvo S60 D5
EX: '79 Golf MK1 2Door, 1.6i MP9. Not self-Build
EX: '05 Golf Chico 1.4 Carb - Self- Project

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Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by panic-mechanic »

180 degrees out on the dissy.
Stephan van Tonder - Jhb - Putfontein Benoni
'05 Audi A6 3.0L TDI Avant
'09 Touareg 3l TDI
'13 VW CC 2l tdi (repair project)
'05 Touareg v10

Perfect Power dealer. I do dyno tuning.
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RJ8V
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Registered for: 8 years 8 months
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Car Model: BT 50 3.2 SLE 4x2
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Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by RJ8V »

What do I do to solve this Panic?

Can this be the main reason why fokkol lines up?
EX: '02 AUDI A3 1.8 20V
EX: '81 Golf Rabbit Mk1, 2e 8V MP9. Not self-Build.
EX: '05 Ford Fiesta ST 2.0 Normal Aspirated
EX: '06 Volvo S60 D5
EX: '79 Golf MK1 2Door, 1.6i MP9. Not self-Build
EX: '05 Golf Chico 1.4 Carb - Self- Project

Image
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Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by panic-mechanic »

Sounds like you made a boo boo somewhere.
Not seeing it makes it hard to diagnose.
Take pictures
Stephan van Tonder - Jhb - Putfontein Benoni
'05 Audi A6 3.0L TDI Avant
'09 Touareg 3l TDI
'13 VW CC 2l tdi (repair project)
'05 Touareg v10

Perfect Power dealer. I do dyno tuning.
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RJ8V
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Registered for: 8 years 8 months
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Car Model: BT 50 3.2 SLE 4x2
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Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by RJ8V »

I'm not sure how to upload photos, can I perhaps PM you for your number, then whatsapp some photos?

Exactly what photos do you need?
EX: '02 AUDI A3 1.8 20V
EX: '81 Golf Rabbit Mk1, 2e 8V MP9. Not self-Build.
EX: '05 Ford Fiesta ST 2.0 Normal Aspirated
EX: '06 Volvo S60 D5
EX: '79 Golf MK1 2Door, 1.6i MP9. Not self-Build
EX: '05 Golf Chico 1.4 Carb - Self- Project

Image
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Posts: 26715
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Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by panic-mechanic »

Upload to a hosting site first
Stephan van Tonder - Jhb - Putfontein Benoni
'05 Audi A6 3.0L TDI Avant
'09 Touareg 3l TDI
'13 VW CC 2l tdi (repair project)
'05 Touareg v10

Perfect Power dealer. I do dyno tuning.
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chucker02
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Car Model: Citi ADY
Location: Bloemfontein

Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by chucker02 »

Why I said in your first post to double check distributor timing, but hope you come right
Current:

2006 Citi Golf 2E, Dictator, 4-2-1

Ex:
2003 Audi A3 1.8t, Thanas Tuned, FMIC, coilies, DP and exhaust
2007 Citi golf. ADY with Spitronics 60-2, estas 282, 4-2-1, coilies
Rides thread: http://vwclub.co.za/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=183329
2002 Citi golf. ADY carb, estas 282, 4-2-1, GW delarey big brake kit.
Rides thread: http://vwclub.co.za/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=157603
1971 VW beetle
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RJ8V
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Car Model: BT 50 3.2 SLE 4x2
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Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by RJ8V »

But that's the whole part I don't understand. The rotor was lined up with the line for cylinder #1, what am I doing wrong then? Should I remove the whole distributor and reinstall ? Because all 3 marks line up. But as soon as I start the car i can't see the v-shape in bell housing when timing light is connected. Only start to see it as soon as i move the whole distributor almost halfway. Even tough marks line up. So should I remove the whole thing?

Getting gatvol and starting to feel stupid, as this is an easy Job that is starting to look like you need a N6 in Engineering.
EX: '02 AUDI A3 1.8 20V
EX: '81 Golf Rabbit Mk1, 2e 8V MP9. Not self-Build.
EX: '05 Ford Fiesta ST 2.0 Normal Aspirated
EX: '06 Volvo S60 D5
EX: '79 Golf MK1 2Door, 1.6i MP9. Not self-Build
EX: '05 Golf Chico 1.4 Carb - Self- Project

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Car Model: Citi ADY
Location: Bloemfontein

Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by chucker02 »

I wonder if your igntion module is not farking around. The advance is controlled electrically on those 1.4's
Current:

2006 Citi Golf 2E, Dictator, 4-2-1

Ex:
2003 Audi A3 1.8t, Thanas Tuned, FMIC, coilies, DP and exhaust
2007 Citi golf. ADY with Spitronics 60-2, estas 282, 4-2-1, coilies
Rides thread: http://vwclub.co.za/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=183329
2002 Citi golf. ADY carb, estas 282, 4-2-1, GW delarey big brake kit.
Rides thread: http://vwclub.co.za/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=157603
1971 VW beetle
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RJ8V
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Posts: 251
Registered for: 8 years 8 months
Car Make: Mazda
Car Model: BT 50 3.2 SLE 4x2
Location: Mpumalanga, Middelburg

Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by RJ8V »

Will it make a difference i I uninstall, turn distributor halfway, reinstall. then line up marks with rotor?

Perhaps I should just send it to a mechanic end of the month.
EX: '02 AUDI A3 1.8 20V
EX: '81 Golf Rabbit Mk1, 2e 8V MP9. Not self-Build.
EX: '05 Ford Fiesta ST 2.0 Normal Aspirated
EX: '06 Volvo S60 D5
EX: '79 Golf MK1 2Door, 1.6i MP9. Not self-Build
EX: '05 Golf Chico 1.4 Carb - Self- Project

Image
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chucker02
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Posts: 2966
Registered for: 11 years 2 months
Car Make: VW
Car Model: Citi ADY
Location: Bloemfontein

Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by chucker02 »

I think you should first post a couple of pics of how everything is installed now. You should upload the photos to photobucket first and the copy the IMG icon to the page
Current:

2006 Citi Golf 2E, Dictator, 4-2-1

Ex:
2003 Audi A3 1.8t, Thanas Tuned, FMIC, coilies, DP and exhaust
2007 Citi golf. ADY with Spitronics 60-2, estas 282, 4-2-1, coilies
Rides thread: http://vwclub.co.za/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=183329
2002 Citi golf. ADY carb, estas 282, 4-2-1, GW delarey big brake kit.
Rides thread: http://vwclub.co.za/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=157603
1971 VW beetle
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RJ8V
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Posts: 251
Registered for: 8 years 8 months
Car Make: Mazda
Car Model: BT 50 3.2 SLE 4x2
Location: Mpumalanga, Middelburg

Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by RJ8V »

Will do this afternoon, then you guys can see what I'm dealing with. Perhaps then can this problem be identified and sorted.
EX: '02 AUDI A3 1.8 20V
EX: '81 Golf Rabbit Mk1, 2e 8V MP9. Not self-Build.
EX: '05 Ford Fiesta ST 2.0 Normal Aspirated
EX: '06 Volvo S60 D5
EX: '79 Golf MK1 2Door, 1.6i MP9. Not self-Build
EX: '05 Golf Chico 1.4 Carb - Self- Project

Image
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RJ8V
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Posts: 251
Registered for: 8 years 8 months
Car Make: Mazda
Car Model: BT 50 3.2 SLE 4x2
Location: Mpumalanga, Middelburg

Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by RJ8V »

Here are the photos of all 3 marks that I lined up.

Image

Image

Image
EX: '02 AUDI A3 1.8 20V
EX: '81 Golf Rabbit Mk1, 2e 8V MP9. Not self-Build.
EX: '05 Ford Fiesta ST 2.0 Normal Aspirated
EX: '06 Volvo S60 D5
EX: '79 Golf MK1 2Door, 1.6i MP9. Not self-Build
EX: '05 Golf Chico 1.4 Carb - Self- Project

Image
User avatar
RJ8V
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Posts: 251
Registered for: 8 years 8 months
Car Make: Mazda
Car Model: BT 50 3.2 SLE 4x2
Location: Mpumalanga, Middelburg

Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by RJ8V »

After all marks where lined up, I started car (tdc) immediately started stalling, setting timing light to 6btdc and still couldn't see v-mark in bell housing, tirned distributor almost halfway only then started seeing the notch on flywheel. So currently timing is at 18 btdc. Higher than this it starts to back fire or spit at exhaust, lower than this then car idles roughly and throttle response when pushing pedal down is jurking. So I don't know anymore to be honest. Bit I can't give up yet. Please assist guys as this is starting to p... me off.
EX: '02 AUDI A3 1.8 20V
EX: '81 Golf Rabbit Mk1, 2e 8V MP9. Not self-Build.
EX: '05 Ford Fiesta ST 2.0 Normal Aspirated
EX: '06 Volvo S60 D5
EX: '79 Golf MK1 2Door, 1.6i MP9. Not self-Build
EX: '05 Golf Chico 1.4 Carb - Self- Project

Image
User avatar
RJ8V
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Posts: 251
Registered for: 8 years 8 months
Car Make: Mazda
Car Model: BT 50 3.2 SLE 4x2
Location: Mpumalanga, Middelburg

Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by RJ8V »

EX: '02 AUDI A3 1.8 20V
EX: '81 Golf Rabbit Mk1, 2e 8V MP9. Not self-Build.
EX: '05 Ford Fiesta ST 2.0 Normal Aspirated
EX: '06 Volvo S60 D5
EX: '79 Golf MK1 2Door, 1.6i MP9. Not self-Build
EX: '05 Golf Chico 1.4 Carb - Self- Project

Image
User avatar
RJ8V
Cadet
Posts: 251
Registered for: 8 years 8 months
Car Make: Mazda
Car Model: BT 50 3.2 SLE 4x2
Location: Mpumalanga, Middelburg

Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by RJ8V »

Image

Image
EX: '02 AUDI A3 1.8 20V
EX: '81 Golf Rabbit Mk1, 2e 8V MP9. Not self-Build.
EX: '05 Ford Fiesta ST 2.0 Normal Aspirated
EX: '06 Volvo S60 D5
EX: '79 Golf MK1 2Door, 1.6i MP9. Not self-Build
EX: '05 Golf Chico 1.4 Carb - Self- Project

Image
User avatar
RJ8V
Cadet
Posts: 251
Registered for: 8 years 8 months
Car Make: Mazda
Car Model: BT 50 3.2 SLE 4x2
Location: Mpumalanga, Middelburg

Re: Timing on Golf mk1 still does not line up, please help

Post by RJ8V »

Image
EX: '02 AUDI A3 1.8 20V
EX: '81 Golf Rabbit Mk1, 2e 8V MP9. Not self-Build.
EX: '05 Ford Fiesta ST 2.0 Normal Aspirated
EX: '06 Volvo S60 D5
EX: '79 Golf MK1 2Door, 1.6i MP9. Not self-Build
EX: '05 Golf Chico 1.4 Carb - Self- Project

Image
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