Crazy Detailer Foam Cannon V2 + Karcher HP washer - URGENT

lawrence · Post by **lawrence** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 10:58 am

Right so I urgently need to get a new HP washer but AFAIK the foam cannon has a max pressure of 120 bar. The HP washer I wanted to get pushes out 130 bar.

I know for a fact there is 1 person who attempted to use a 160 bar HP washer and is having issues where the HP washer keeps turning off (presumably because the cannon has now effectively caused a 'blockage').

So, although I have been advised against trying to pump 130 bar through the cannon, I would like to know if any of you that are using the V2 foam cannon are doing so on a Karcher HP Washer with more than 120 bar with or without issues.

Talk to me....

Lambchop · Post by **Lambchop** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 11:02 am

lawrence wrote:Right so I urgently need to get a new HP washer but AFAIK the foam cannon has a max pressure of 120 bar. The HP washer I wanted to get pushes out 130 bar.

I know for a fact there is 1 person who attempted to use a 160 bar HP washer and is having issues where the HP washer keeps turning off (presumably because the cannon has now effectively caused a 'blockage').

So, although I have been advised against trying to pump 130 bar through the cannon, I would like to know if any of you that are using the V2 foam cannon are doing so on a Karcher HP Washer with more than 120 bar with or without issues.

Talk to me....

I have a Karcher K7 and i have no issues with Foam Canons or the machine switching off. On the canon there should be a pressure rating.
My advise to you would be to get a decent washer with a brass cylinder head rather then the cheap plastic ones.

lawrence · Post by **lawrence** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 11:22 am

Lambchop wrote:My advise to you would be to get a decent washer with a brass cylinder head rather then the cheap plastic ones.

Huh?

Brass Cylinder head..... what be that then?

How does one tell if the washer has a brass cylinder head?

Also, forgive my stupidity today but are your saying that your HP washer pushed out more pressure than the rating on the cannon, or is it within the specs for the cannon?

Lambchop · Post by **Lambchop** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 11:32 am

lawrence wrote:
Lambchop wrote:My advise to you would be to get a decent washer with a brass cylinder head rather then the cheap plastic ones.
Huh? Brass Cylinder head..... what be that then?

How does one tell if the washer has a brass cylinder head?

Also, forgive my stupidity today but are your saying that your HP washer pushed out more pressure than the rating on the cannon, or is it within the specs for the cannon?

So all the K series Karcher pressure washer excpet for the K7 and Pro range have a plastic cylinder head.
with the increase and decrease in pressure on the head it eventually cracks resulting in a loss of pressure. I know cos ive stripped my old washers enough times

The canon I have is rated to 180 bar so well within the pressure washer specs which is 160 bar

lawrence · Post by **lawrence** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 11:33 am

....and the cracked head is what I assume causes the water to leak out the machine ?

This is the issue I have now

Lambchop · Post by **Lambchop** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 11:38 am

lawrence wrote:....and the cracked head is what I assume causes the water to leak out the machine ?

This is the issue I have now

Im afraid so Lawrence! If you can afford splash the cash and get the bigger model otherwise buy a new machine or have it fixed.

Solo786 · Post by **Solo786** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 1:52 pm

Lambchop wrote:
lawrence wrote:....and the cracked head is what I assume causes the water to leak out the machine ?

This is the issue I have now
Im afraid so Lawrence! If you can afford splash the cash and get the bigger model otherwise buy a new machine or have it fixed.

I dont have a any problem using the MTM foam canon that i bought decades ago - still works great, and no issues with my HP washer shutting off.

lawrence · Post by **lawrence** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 2:13 pm

I suspect the original MTM has a higher pressure rating than the new V2 foam cannon - dunno?

In any event, it looks like I am going to have to give it a re-think.....

If the only HP washer with a brass cylinder is the K7 then it makes sense to get one of these from a durability perspective, but then I *may* need to change the cannon....

Eish

LostEnigma · Post by **LostEnigma** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 2:40 pm

Lawrence I assume you wanna get the k5 series... It's what I am using with the foam cannon from Vish and the mtm one from Cd... Both love the machine for half a year so far

lawrence · Post by **lawrence** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 3:53 pm

Yeah I am looking at the K5.700

Karcher themselves have confirmed it is a metal casing and not plastic, so that is a win!!!

It also seems to have a really nice long hose (that's what she said

) but I have read some reviews that the hose reel situated on the top of the unit makes it top heavy and susceptible to falling over, and that the hose doesn't retract well into the reel.... not sure how valid these concerns are.

Do you have the same model and if so, can you comment on the hose reel issue?

LostEnigma · Post by **LostEnigma** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 4:31 pm

I do have that exact machine..

Honestly it's fallen over once from my laziness.. Unwind the wheel completely before tugging on the hose and you will never have an issue... And the hose winds up like a dream! Never an issue! Only point I could say irritates me is that, like any hose or cable that gets rolled up, you need to undo the loops etc quite often that it forms.

But otherwise this is a super machine with perfect strength for all detailing duties!

Lambchop · Post by **Lambchop** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 5:08 pm

lawrence wrote:Yeah I am looking at the K5.700

Karcher themselves have confirmed it is a metal casing and not plastic, so that is a win!!!

It also seems to have a really nice long hose (that's what she said ) but I have read some reviews that the hose reel situated on the top of the unit makes it top heavy and susceptible to falling over, and that the hose doesn't retract well into the reel.... not sure how valid these concerns are.

Do you have the same model and if so, can you comment on the hose reel issue?

let me show you the difference between a K5 and K7 Cylinder head
BTW - no need to change attachments for the K series. The foamer will work just fine

K7 Cylinder head

K 5 Cylinder Head

Pristine Detailing · Post by **Pristine Detailing** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 5:44 pm

lawrence wrote:Right so I urgently need to get a new HP washer but AFAIK the foam cannon has a max pressure of 120 bar. The HP washer I wanted to get pushes out 130 bar.

I know for a fact there is 1 person who attempted to use a 160 bar HP washer and is having issues where the HP washer keeps turning off (presumably because the cannon has now effectively caused a 'blockage').

So, although I have been advised against trying to pump 130 bar through the cannon, I would like to know if any of you that are using the V2 foam cannon are doing so on a Karcher HP Washer with more than 120 bar with or without issues.

Talk to me....

Gees bud...ur having a bad machine week...vacuum ..now hp washer

K7 definately I'd say..
Chop didn't you say that with the cost of repair, you may as well buy a new machine?

lawrence · Post by **lawrence** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 5:56 pm

Lambchop wrote:
lawrence wrote:Yeah I am looking at the K5.700

Karcher themselves have confirmed it is a metal casing and not plastic, so that is a win!!!

It also seems to have a really nice long hose (that's what she said ) but I have read some reviews that the hose reel situated on the top of the unit makes it top heavy and susceptible to falling over, and that the hose doesn't retract well into the reel.... not sure how valid these concerns are.

Do you have the same model and if so, can you comment on the hose reel issue?

let me show you the difference between a K5 and K7 Cylinder head
BTW - no need to change attachments for the K series. The foamer will work just fine

K7 Cylinder head

K 5 Cylinder Head

Thanks for this...

Quite a massive difference in design

No wonder the lower end units fail like they do.... I received an email from Karcher themselves today confirming that the K5.7 has the metal cylinder head, but after seeing this, I think I need to send him the pics and get him to tripple check....

Auto Finesse SA wrote:Gees bud...ur having a bad machine week...vacuum ..now hp washer

K7 definately I'd say..
Chop didn't you say that with the cost of repair, you may as well buy a new machine?

perfect timing too.... right after Christmas....you know.... when we all have fat wallets

Lambchop · Post by **Lambchop** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 6:12 pm

have a look at this video to see what I mean
Yes there is steel on top on the head but the head itself is plastic

https://www.youtube.com/watch?annotatio ... QOoG7kPJDc

lawrence · Post by **lawrence** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 6:37 pm

Lambchop wrote:have a look at this video to see what I mean
Yes there is steel on top on the head but the head itself is plastic

https://www.youtube.com/watch?annotatio ... QOoG7kPJDc

Thanks bud

Watched all 3 videos

Djin · Post by **Djin** » Thu Jan 08, 2015 8:40 am

The cannons are currently rated at 120 bar as is and we are told this is due to the fitting attachment. We have a replacement attachment that is being sent to us to test for higher pressure machines. It will take the rating up to between 180-200 bar. A bit of an overkill I think, but if there is a need we will of course supply.

The current cannon works beautifully with smaller pressure machines which are the most common. What we found with the MTM's and PA's is they did not generate enough foam on lower pressure. V2 handles this like charm. From my testing, I got more foam with the V2 compared to my older MTM. (I'm using a K2.3 - 120 BAR)

If its just a case of swapping the attachments then the CD V2 cannon can be supplied with either fitting depending on the pressure output of your machine. I will revert back once I have tested the different attachment.

lawrence · Post by **lawrence** » Thu Jan 08, 2015 8:41 am

Thanks for the update bud

lawrence · Post by **lawrence** » Fri Jan 09, 2015 11:54 am

Pravin, when will these new fittings be arriving and tested?

The more I look into this, the more it would seem this is the route I need to go.

The K7 Karcher with a higher capacity foam cannon....

After lengthy discussions with the guys from Karcher yesterday, this is what I have been told - some of which (like the duty cycle) I had no clue about

The K7 is the only machine with a brass cylinder head. It is rated at 160bar and has a duty cycle of 1 hour. This means it can be used for a maximum of 1 constant use and then must be shut off for at least 30 minutes - this is a water cooled machine.

The K5.2 and K5.7 supposedly have metal (not brass, not plastic) cylinder heads which are more durable than the plastic ones, but less durable than the K7. This however contradicts the pics Lambchop posted of the cylinder heads, so short of opening up a brand new K5.7 I don't know if the Karcher dude is just trying to pull the wool over my eyes. These are 130 bar machines (so currently too powerful (supposedly) for the new V2 cannons. These machines have a duty cycle of 40 minutes before needing to be shut down for 30 mins. They are also water cooled.

The K4, 3 and 2 series all have plastic cylinder heads, and a duty cycle of 30 minutes, before needing 30 minutes cooling off period - these are air cooled machine.

The K1 series is the same as above but with only a 10 minute duty cycle....

According to Karcher, some of the common causes of the failed cylinder heads are:

1. Exceeding the duty cycle - i.e. working the machine too long before allowing cooling off periods
2. Insufficient supply of water to the machine from your tap
3. Not bleeding the system of all air before turning it on
4. Pushing dirty water through the machine
5. Using 'unauthorized' chemicals in the machine

And then as lambchop mentioned, the constant on/off nature of these machines causes cracks in the cylinder head itself,or the seals therein to fail.

Lambchop · Post by **Lambchop** » Fri Jan 09, 2015 8:02 pm

Nice info!

Belix · Post by **Belix** » Fri Jan 09, 2015 11:21 pm

How do you bleed the air? I always get air going through at the start, never thought anything of it

Abnormal · Post by **Abnormal** » Fri Jan 09, 2015 11:41 pm

squeeze trigger until water flows before switching on

Belix · Post by **Belix** » Sat Jan 10, 2015 12:08 pm

Good to know thanks, should have been obvious. Wonder what the run time for my K2 is...

Djin · Post by **Djin** » Sun Jan 11, 2015 12:56 pm

lawrence wrote:Pravin, when will these new fittings be arriving and tested?

We have the new fittings on order so we expect delivery in a couple of weeks.

According to Karcher, some of the common causes of the failed cylinder heads are:

1. Exceeding the duty cycle - i.e. working the machine too long before allowing cooling off periods
2. Insufficient supply of water to the machine from your tap
3. Not bleeding the system of all air before turning it on
4. Pushing dirty water through the machine
5. Using 'unauthorized' chemicals in the machine

Out of that list I don't do any of that yet I still had a machine fail on me after about 2-3 years. But what I am guilty of is switching the machine on and off constantly. So now I will be making a conscious decision to rather keep the machine running for a longer period (max around 5 mins), and then allowing to cool down sufficiently.

Thanks for the info

Post by **Mbuzi** » Mon Jan 19, 2015 9:01 am

CrazyDetailer's Foam Cannon + Maxi Suds II at work. The snow foam was thick and as a first time user of these products I must say I'm sold and will never ever wash my car without a foam cannon and snow foam. Thanks to the guys in this forum for the advises, it helps in making sure we take care of our rides' paint.

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